You should never be crushing a neck using a bushing set up unless you are just going too far at one whack. Wilson bushings have a bit more chamfer going into the hole than the Reddings and seem to run easier. Additionally on the Wilson you can flip it NUMBER SIDE DOWN and pick up 0.005 tighter necks. The Redding is straight through and you gain nothing by flipping it. Make sure you OUTSIDE chamfer the neck when you are going down as the square edge can be problematic when it enters the bushing. Whatever works is fine. Your choice.
Case lube needs to be applied to the body only not the shoulders though if done so it should be sparing as lube doesn't compress and you get shoulder dents. No structural issues as they iron out on shooting. Just aesthetically not pleasing. Inside neck lubricant is good when running an expander ball. Not needed with bushing only dies. It does aid in drawing the ball back through the undersized neck and will cut down on neck stretch somewhat. It make no difference in crushing necks going in and cannot cause any problems unless you are sizing up and in most cases it is not a problem. I've necked up cases from 6.5/6.8 to 0.308 with the Hornady tapered expander balls and never lost a case. On those you should make sure there is a bit of lube going in. Anything to ease the friction on that snake swallowing that pig.
Spray lubes are fine given two things. I use Hornady One Shot by the bucketful. You cannot be parsimonious on it. Hit them hard from all angles and down in the neck. LET IT DRY!!!! And I mean DRY!! or you will stick a case in a heartbeat. When you get a new set of dies that you have cleaned prior to using, you did clean them with brake cleaner right?, squirt a bit up in the die to pre-lube the surfaces. This will decrease your chances of sticking that first case. Make sure you let the die dry also.
In my experience the Dillon stuff stays greasy for a long time after application. The Hornady dries to the touch. I have not used the RCBS version. I also use a ton of Imperial on low number round loading. Regardless of type it needs to be removed after the sizing. You can do this prior to loading or you can do it post loading. You can tumble the lubed brass after sizing or defer and then wipe it off with a towel soaked in rubbing alcohol. Lube removal is important for pressures on firing.
Lube is too cheap. I wouldn't make up my own Brylcreem.
Obviously on the SAMMI stuff you can buy standard dies of various grades and quality of workmanship. Bushings or regular are all good to go. The bushings will allow you to control neck tension quite a bit more then the one size fits all on the expanders. In the wildcat world bushings are your friend. The 6X6.8 from CH4D is a great die and thanks to BHW is available to make loading that one as easy as 223. They also do a 25X223 (25X45) die that works great on the 25X45 SHARPS BHW does.
Dies that are the best? Winners for years in LR have used the Redding and Forster bushing set ups. Very few, if any, use standard dies. RCBS and Hornady both make bushing style dies. I've not shot with anyone using them but then I only shoot in the Valley of the Sun. It comes down to control of as much in sizing and seating as you can have in accuracy. I can turn out super match, sub-MOA, ammo on my 650 but when it comes to the day in day out out yonder stuff I'll get all my single stage stuff set up and do my batch work. One at a time with attention to everything is where it is at. I use to shoot 2-3,000 rounds of pistol ammunition a month and the Dillon worked fine. I would shoot maybe 1000 rounds of true match rifle in a year and the Dillon worked well. Now I don't shoot as much and cutting edge accuracy is what I look at. The bushing dies make that happen for me because of the control potential.
I buy only Redding bushing dies if it is a serious gun for me. I will buy Hornady if available and then RCBS in the standard world stuff. I bought four Reddings last year, five Hornady, two CH4D and one RCBS because the Hornady was not available in 17 Remington when I needed it. I can mix and match as I go and do well but if I were choosing only one standard brand it would be the Hornady if I did not want to step up and pay five to ten dollars more for the standard Reddings.
Just some general thoughts and my experiences. Everyone gets there eventually and hopefully we all have fun arriving.
Last Edit: Oct 20, 2015 15:08:03 GMT -8 by GLSHOOTER
The best firearm for self defense? Any loaded one will do.
Wow that is a lot of great info, took me few minutes to wrap my head round it all ha. The info on the lub was great and save me and others I'm sure some time , frustration, and money I'm sure! Know it will me. The info on the die sets is just what I was asking and trying to find out...thank you for that.
Yes after enough time at the table and many wrong and wright turns I'm sure we can all get there but I want to get there with as little wrong turns, lost time and money thrown down the drain as I can. With people like you who have already been down that road and have learned from it and or willing to help out newcomers like me it sure makes the ride a little gunner. Thanks again for all your help and advice!
Post by oldjarhead on Jan 19, 2018 13:33:23 GMT -8
I've pretty new at it, about 29 years now been rolling my own. Lessons learned the hard way as there was no internet, no forums just people you hoped you could trust. Lots have been covered here, all good too. Take your time, be patient, get a second job to finance this endeavor as it's extremely addicting. There is no rehab from this affliction, so be prepared. The results will amaze you and far outweigh the time and costs associated.
My 2 cents worth;
Imperial Sizing Die lube - never be without. Mica for neck sizing, especially on the way up Favorite single stage press (for precision loading) Forster Co-Ax Favorite progressive press - Dillon 550, 650 or 1050. Just depends on how much lunch money you can squirrel away Sierra bullets are so consistent, but others are good too. Bergers, Barnes, Noslers, Speers. Depends on the application Powder - Good Lord has finally blessed us with so many to choose from. Fun part is finding out which one works best for the load you're working up Beware the Widget monster! Brownells, Sinclair and others have page upon page of "ohhhh, I gotta get one of those" widgets. Again, budget killers Buy the best dies you can afford. Keep them clean Never try to explain to your bitter, I mean better half why you just ordered a $300.00 die set. She'll never understand. Get a secret credit card and never give her access to the account. Clean brass is so much easier to work with. Tumble, vibrate, whatever, but always run clean brass through your dies Be safe, be safe, be safe. You're playing with stuff that goes boom. Wear your safety glasses. Wait till later to smoke that Davidoff you got for Christmas Good lighting is a must. No, great lighting is a must.