Blocking the gas port to de-semi an AR rifle...

[peabody]

I can't begin to tell you how much angst I'm feeling right now - living in California and, despite signing petition after petition to stop the anti-gun measures that headed to the governor, watching a gleeful liberal media celebrate the signing of a majority of said bills "in the name of public safety"... Because law-abiding citizens are dangerous.  

With that noted, I am looking at ways to modify my ARs so they are not "assault weapons" as vaguely-defined by the new laws, which will likely go into effect 01 January 2017.  And please, don't turn this into a political debate on how communist California has become, or how "we" didn't do enough to stop it.  I'm already drowning in a pool of (insert your favorite 4 letter word) over it.

I have already been researching options to convert to a "fixed magazine".  But the vague definition has yet to interpreted by state law enforcement.  And I strongly suspect the next round of disarmament legislation will focus on eliminating all semi-auto, center-fire rifles - even with a fixed magazine.  

So... my question is focused on blocking the gas port to convert an AR to a manually cycled rifle, with the specific concerns being:

- Effects of carbon buildup and fouling of the barrel's gas port due to a plugged gas block.
- The wear on the bolt assembly due to the stresses of non-cyclic firing.  I'm not sure this is really an issue.  But I have wondered if the bolt might get stressed over time when taking the full force of the round firing, vs some of the energy expended through the cycling of the bolt... if that makes sense.

That's it.  Your thoughts?

[tonythetiger]

Bummer. If I was in your shoes and unwilling to pack my bags and GTFO, I'd consider welding the port closed and eliminating the gas block and tube entirely. Then I'd get pissed about my neutered rifle and move...

[Deleted]

Jul 2, 2016 14:45:43 GMT -8 peabody said:

I can't begin to tell you how much angst I'm feeling right now - living in California and, despite signing petition after petition to stop the anti-gun measures that headed to the governor, watching a gleeful liberal media celebrate the signing of a majority of said bills "in the name of public safety"... Because law-abiding citizens are dangerous.  

With that noted, I am looking at ways to modify my ARs so they are not "assault weapons" as vaguely-defined by the new laws, which will likely go into effect 01 January 2017.  And please, don't turn this into a political debate on how communist California has become, or how "we" didn't do enough to stop it.  I'm already drowning in a pool of (insert your favorite 4 letter word) over it.

I have already been researching options to convert to a "fixed magazine".  But the vague definition has yet to interpreted by state law enforcement.  And I strongly suspect the next round of disarmament legislation will focus on eliminating all semi-auto, center-fire rifles - even with a fixed magazine.  

So... my question is focused on blocking the gas port to convert an AR to a manually cycled rifle, with the specific concerns being:

- Effects of carbon buildup and fouling of the barrel's gas port due to a plugged gas block.
- The wear on the bolt assembly due to the stresses of non-cyclic firing.  I'm not sure this is really an issue.  But I have wondered if the bolt might get stressed over time when taking the full force of the round firing, vs some of the energy expended through the cycling of the bolt... if that makes sense.

That's it.  Your thoughts?

There are several ways to disable the gas system. If you have an adjustable gas block simply turn the screw all the way in against the stop. The best way is to simply remove the gas tube and turn the gas block around. If you still want the look with the gas block in the proper position, remove the gas tube and turn it over and bend the tube to fit into the receiver. DON'T WELD THE BARREL. Any of the above will disable the gas system turning your upper into a manually operated firearm.

You won't see any additional wear on your bolt. In fact you should have less wear working the action by hand.

[peabody]

Thanks for the input.  I've read of individuals installing the gas block in reverse (tube opening forward).  I've also read of some stubbing the gas tube to extend about 1/2" out of the gas block and pinning it in upside down (port opening up).  My only concern, though minor, would be the effect of carbon and copper build up within the port opening on accuracy.  But I suspect it would be minor, if at all.

The "de-semification" of my rifles is a last resort.  However, with the pending ammo restrictions coming next year... You know, the required background checks (with fees) for each and every ammo purchase, special permits to sell ammo within the state, required recording of ammo sales with record retention, prohibition of importation of ammo from out-of-state... and internet sales of ammo too, a manually cycled rifle will make my limited ammo purchases last that much longer... Sweet!!! 

Thanks Uncle Jerry and all of your communist cronies! We all feel really safe now!!! 

[GLSHOOTER]

Jul 2, 2016 22:39:25 GMT -8 peabody said:

Thanks for the input.  I've read of individuals installing the gas block in reverse (tube opening forward).  I've also read of some stubbing the gas tube to extend about 1/2" out of the gas block and pinning it in upside down (port opening up).  My only concern, though minor, would be the effect of carbon and copper build up within the port opening on accuracy.  But I suspect it would be minor, if at all.

The "de-semification" of my rifles is a last resort.  However, with the pending ammo restrictions coming next year... You know, the required background checks (with fees) for each and every ammo purchase, special permits to sell ammo within the state, required recording of ammo sales with record retention, prohibition of importation of ammo from out-of-state... and internet sales of ammo too, a manually cycled rifle will make my limited ammo purchases last that much longer... Sweet!!! 

Thanks Uncle Jerry and all of your communist cronies! We all feel really safe now!!! 

My concern would be that they will hammer you as readily convertible and not a permanent fix like the pined muzzle break rule for the ATFE.

I know that BHW has done several no gas hole AR barrels and many straight pulls have been built. A side charger can be pretty darn fast run manually.

Greg

[tonythetiger]

I've seen plenty of barrel welding and fabrication relating to TC Contenders and such, a skilled welder can do it without harming the barrel. I suggested welding because, while I don't know the details of the new laws, I assumed something as easily reversed as a backwards gas block would be frowned upon.

[peabody]

I'm OK with pinning a gas block or the gas tube stub in an orientation that blocks the gas port.  I suspect the absolute compliance would be a barrel with no gas port, as Greg mentioned.  But that means I'd have to swap all of my barrels, which won't be cheap.  But that is not required at the moment.  If they amend the verbiage to outlaw a "readily or potentially convertible" state - i.e. the rifle could be converted back to an "assault rifle" configuration by any means, then that's a different and very nasty tasting cup of tea...

As it stands, I'm reading over the new legislation and the still-pending proposed bills... and Lt Gov Gavin Newsom's "Safety for all" ballot measure that redundantly covers the much of the same gamut of freshly signed legislation... to figure out what configuration(s) will keep me compliant with the new laws without having to register my rifles as "assault rifles" with the state.  I don't want to be on a DOJ list that will leave me targeted for inspection/confiscation when they ban all center fire, semi auto rifles.  And that appears to be where they're heading.  


Non-semi auto is a "go".  Fixed magazine is too, for the moment, though what LE will call "legal" will be subject to interpretation.  The new law will define "fixed magazine" as a magazine that can only be removed by disassembly of the action.  The use of a tool (like with the bullet button) is being outlawed.  For the AR, the simple solution is the ARMagLock.  It requires the operator to tip the upper receiver by pulling the rear pin, which is a partial disassembly of the action.  Is it going to be enough?  Can't be sure.  Beyond that, I'm watching the CA forums to monitor the debate over proposed solutions and legalities of the new laws.  

Regarding the side-charging option: what is the most cost-effective means to convert to a side-charge configuration?  I'm also looking at converting to a pump action, along the lines of the Troy pump action AR.  But that rifle is not a modified AR.  It's a custom design from the ground up.  I would rather swap out the handguard and gas tubes on my existing uppers to convert them, which others have done.  But the current of-the-shelf options are limited and pricey.

Your thoughts? 

[Master Yoda]

I drill and tap and use set screws all the time to close or modify gas port holes

[peabody]

Jul 7, 2016 21:38:12 GMT -8 Master Yoda said:

I drill and tap and use set screws all the time to close or modify gas port holes

Is this done on the gas block or the port hole on the barrel?  I have 2 uppers with adjustable gas blocks (yet to be fired).  I'm familiar with that concept and know the adjusting screw can be tightened up to cap the port.  Haven't seen it done on a barrel yet.  But that is an interesting possibility, though reversing a gas block and pinning it would be easier, I think.  

[GLSHOOTER]

Jul 8, 2016 7:36:48 GMT -8 peabody said:

Jul 7, 2016 21:38:12 GMT -8 Master Yoda said:

I drill and tap and use set screws all the time to close or modify gas port holes

Is this done on the gas block or the port hole on the barrel?  I have 2 uppers with adjustable gas blocks (yet to be fired).  I'm familiar with that concept and know the adjusting screw can be tightened up to cap the port.  Haven't seen it done on a barrel yet.  But that is an interesting possibility, though reversing a gas block and pinning it would be easier, I think.  

He is drilling the gas port and filling that out. The adjustable gas blocks would be OK but if you want to flat shut it off and not do the barrel buy a STANDARD gas block and fill that hole in the block leaving the barrel alone.

Grrg

[peabody]

Thanks Greg and Master Yoda.  Makes sense.  I'd prefer working on the gas block as it could be replaced later on down the road, should other configuration options become legally tolerated... so to speak.  As it stands, semi-auto centerfire with a fixed mag (10 rounds or less and requiring disassembly of the action for removal) is the minimum legal alteration coming down the pipe in CA.  After reviewing the signed legislation, the new draconian-measures are very similar to the current Connecticut and NY Safe Act.  So "de-assaultification" mods are out there that should pass muster with CA DOJ.  In theory, at least. 

[204ar]

So do they pin the mag in place somehow and load it by un-pinning and opening the action? What a joke. I feel bad for you folks out there.

[peabody]

The ARMagLock is the least invasive of the fixed mag modifications.  It is basically an enlarged mag release button that extends up to the level of the upper receiver.  It has a small tab that protrudes from the extension to actually touch the upper receiver, thus preventing the mag release from being depressed when the upper and lower are functionally mated.  And you can't use a tool to bypass it unless you disassemble the action, which is as simple as pulling the rear take down pin and pivoting the upper receiver assembly forward.  I guess partial disassembly is disassembly none the less.  However, that pivoting of the upper allows the ARMagLock to freely function as a magazine release because the upper receiver body is no longer blocking the movement of the mag release button.  And that's kosher to the law because a fixed magazine is one that can only be removed with the action disassembled (again, in theory).  Lots of words.  Here's a link to the demo video: ARMagLock.  That will make more sense than my "blah, blah, blah". 

I have also found another option, which is basically a mag release assembly that bolts in and doesn't move.  So once you put in a magazine and install the device, your mag is truly "fixed".  You have to tilt the upper to load the magazine.  It's reversible. But if you have a double feed or a jam, it will be more dangerous to clear than with the ARMagLock... which is still more of a safety concern than the standard configuration of the AR platform.  Maybe that's the whole scheme to improving public safety: you make operating a firearm more dangerous for the operator.