6x45 LTR

[crk]

Is anyone running one of the LTR profiles in 6x45? If so, how's it working for you? How much does your finished rig weigh? I'm thinking about putting together a lightweight AR for my dad to hunt with. He just turned 79 last month. He has arthritis in his shoulders and hands, so he doesn't need a rifle that is heavy or has much recoil. He has also gotten to the point where he always complains about being cold, so the amount of clothing he wears from a cold morning to a warm afternoon varies quite a bit. Obtaining proper eye relief with a scope has gotten to be a problem for him. I think an AR with an adjustable butt stock would address a lot of his problems. We are in northeast Georgia, shooting white tailed deer in wooded areas. Shots are short, usually less than 150 yards. Most of the deer are between 100-130 lbs, some on up to 200 lbs, though. I think the 6x45 with a 18" or 20" barrel would be great for purpose intended. The 85 grain game king ought to handle anything we would come across in the woods. Any experience or advise you can share with me that would help with this project would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Chris

[Deleted]

I am working in several setups including 3 new 5x45 systems. I am ordering a new barrel from BHW to see how it goes with superformance powders.
6x45 should be the MBR for the US troops. That is a no brainer.
I have everything documented and I am happy to share here.
Loads, ballistics charts, etc...
At the moment I have 90gr pills at 2780fps and 100gr at 2640fps
Ballistics are superior to 6.8, .308, .311 etc.. even most 6.5 in the capable grains.
I am expecting to improve shortly and follow QL directives.

This is a great round to pop white tail, black bear, hogs, Taliban etc...

I would keep it simple. Light weight setup with std 20" barrel
fluted. A carbon fiber rail (weightless) and Ace stock (also very light). For eye relieve and lightness check the burris timberline 2-7.
Amazing little scope so light and great picture with drop comp.
I can weight some of mine but they are loaded so you want something lighter.
Even consider a polymer billet. They are much lighter and strong and working ok so far. That is the future. Aluminum still is more
romantic though.

Other than that get him a keltec SU-16CA. That is the lightest easiest, most reliable ranch carbine you can get but that is .223 and might not be legal.
You might have one of those rebored to 6mm but it is going to cost you more than building a new AR.

Thanks.

[guncollector]

Sergio,
I have a 6x45 20 inch barrel and railed receiver on order. I should be getting it soon. I am very interested in the information and load data you have on this caliber. You stated you are willing to share here. Please do.
Thanks,
Bob

Aug 30, 2011 19:05:10 GMT -8 @sergiomartinez said:

I am working in several setups including 3 new 5x45 systems. I am ordering a new barrel from BHW to see how it goes with superformance powders.
6x45 should be the MBR for the US troops. That is a no brainer.
I have everything documented and I am happy to share here.
Loads, ballistics charts, etc...
At the moment I have 90gr pills at 2780fps and 100gr at 2640fps
Ballistics are superior to 6.8, .308, .311 etc.. even most 6.5 in the capable grains.
I am expecting to improve shortly and follow QL directives.

This is a great round to pop white tail, black bear, hogs, Taliban etc...

I would keep it simple. Light weight setup with std 20" barrel
fluted. A carbon fiber rail (weightless) and Ace stock (also very light). For eye relieve and lightness check the burris timberline 2-7.
Amazing little scope so light and great picture with drop comp.
I can weight some of mine but they are loaded so you want something lighter.
Even consider a polymer billet. They are much lighter and strong and working ok so far. That is the future. Aluminum still is more
romantic though.

Other than that get him a keltec SU-16CA. That is the lightest easiest, most reliable ranch carbine you can get but that is .223 and might not be legal.
You might have one of those rebored to 6mm but it is going to cost you more than building a new AR.

Thanks.

[Deleted]

Yes, now that the summer is over and we get into the winter I always have several projects going on at the same time.
This 6x45 will give me 2750fps with a 90gr bullet and a hot load. I work these up slowly for my hunting and give amazing downrange performance. I am close to 1000ft/lb at 300 yards which makes this round a perfect 300 yards round.
I think that you can get a tad shorter light barrel one and still have a great 200-250 yards system for white tail, black bear and other game.
For accuracy fun work I can work a lighter load and bullet with the same bullet path.
The main thing I like about this case is the extreme accuracy you get of sometimes discarded brass. It is amazingly simple yet effective.

Please send me any questions. At the moment I would keep the following things in mind:
- It is a very simple and forgiving to reload.
- Redding dies are the best for this.
- Do full resize, some NATO round need trimming. Soft brass can be used but not desirable for hot loads. FC/Winchester
- Any nato brass, including LC, PPU, etc.. is good to neck up of down.
- Any .223 load is a good starting point for a new load. VArget and H4895 are good performers as usual. I am getting the 24" barrel to see where we can get with the slower barrels.
You can start with any .223 load for example a 70gr start load in .223 will be a great reference for a 80gr start load in 6x45.
- Get a good mil-spec bolt. Initially those advertised as Carpenter 158 steel HPT/MP Tested Bolt is the norm. It looks that BHW has some very nice ones on sale.
- Other than that make sure you get your upper properly gassed with a nice BCG throwing the brass at 4 o'clock and you shall have a big smile when you see the groups closing up.
- Do not need lapua to get this thing to rock.... but a few of those cases do not hurt for surgical work.
- A few good bullets tested, 65gr Vmax, 75gr vMax, 87gr Vmax, 90gr SGK, 100gr SGK, Hornady SP 87gr (Cheap to break in), 85 gr Sierra HPBT not good feeding, hp FTE issues, once is the air it prints very well. 105 Hornady A-max. very good, too heavy for this case but doable. I recommend 2.3+ COAL and an special/ open magazine for these.
- Lastly, watch out, this is so easy and so fun that it contagious and in might spread to other uppers! LOL!

Anything else give me a shout.

Cheers.
E.

[GLSHOOTER]

Sept 26, 2011 18:06:01 GMT -8 @sergiomartinez said:

Yes, now that the summer is over and we get into the winter I always have several projects going on at the same time.
This 6x45 will give me 2750fps with a 90gr bullet and a hot load. I work these up slowly for my hunting and give amazing downrange performance. I am close to 1000ft/lb at 300 yards which makes this round a perfect 300 yards round.
I think that you can get a tad shorter light barrel one and still have a great 200-250 yards system for white tail, black bear and other game.
For accuracy fun work I can work a lighter load and bullet with the same bullet path.
The main thing I like about this case is the extreme accuracy you get of sometimes discarded brass. It is amazingly simple yet effective.

Please send me any questions. At the moment I would keep the following things in mind:
- It is a very simple and forgiving to reload.
- Redding dies are the best for this.
- Do full resize, some NATO round need trimming. Soft brass can be used but not desirable for hot loads. FC/Winchester
- Any nato brass, including LC, PPU, etc.. is good to neck up of down.
- Any .223 load is a good starting point for a new load. VArget and H4895 are good performers as usual. I am getting the 24" barrel to see where we can get with the slower barrels.
You can start with any .223 load for example a 70gr start load in .223 will be a great reference for a 80gr start load in 6x45.
- Get a good mil-spec bolt. Initially those advertised as Carpenter 158 steel HPT/MP Tested Bolt is the norm. It looks that BHW has some very nice ones on sale.
- Other than that make sure you get your upper properly gassed with a nice BCG throwing the brass at 4 o'clock and you shall have a big smile when you see the groups closing up.
- Do not need lapua to get this thing to rock.... but a few of those cases do not hurt for surgical work.
- A few good bullets tested, 65gr Vmax, 75gr vMax, 87gr Vmax, 90gr SGK, 100gr SGK, Hornady SP 87gr (Cheap to break in), 85 gr Sierra HPBT not good feeding, hp FTE issues, once is the air it prints very well. 105 Hornady A-max. very good, too heavy for this case but doable. I recommend 2.3+ COAL and an special/ open magazine for these.
- Lastly, watch out, this is so easy and so fun that it contagious and in might spread to other uppers! LOL!

Anything else give me a shout.

Cheers.
E.

Interesting post. What are you shooting your 6X45's in? Have you shot any large game with it? Where are you getting your 2.300 mags? Is it HK or FN making them, I forget which.

Greg

[Deleted]

I have a couple LW barrels and they have their earned place but they are very expensive, specially for experimentation calibers.
I have shot deer and several hogs with 6x45. Many behind the ear as usual due to the extreme accuracy. Also some coyotes, the closest at 247 yards. One at 454 yards (2 shots). I am doing .3 to .5 MOA very repeatable. VLDs for the coyotes and v-Maxes and TTSX for the rest.
I cannot wait to try the polygonal rifling. I thin this will help in several aspects as advertised.
Reduce drag and this along with VLD (less bearing surface) will translate into a tad more speed. That is the theory at least. I realize I might have to wait until you get 1:9 or 1:8 twists. I want to see if we can demonstrate the superformance claims. A tad more speed in the 6x45 is always a nice thing we can use. I am ready to put some shanks in the bullets if needed too.
For long range coyote hunting I have created magazines myself that allow better COAL. Even if you get a 5 round C mag and a file you can have 3+1 feed w/o any problems. More than anyone needs for hunting and accuracy testing.
I have some H&Ks, canmegas and others and do not come close to the modified version.

[Deleted]

I am posting some of my charts for comparison. I have more calibers if anyone is interested. The spreads are measured with RCBS ammo master, same altitude and similar weather conditions...

[GLSHOOTER]

I have been a fan of the 6X45 for well over two decades. I have shot them extensively and done a bit of load data work ups. Since we have got in to the chart sharing mind set I would like to set you all up with a link to Predator Masters on the subject of the 6X45 with bullets from 55 on up to 90. This fellow has done a ton of work and complied a great PDF file. It is down several posts from the top of the thread.

Look it over and take note of the COL of the cartridges being much longer than standard. Take not also that the pressures are not off the charts with his loads though some of them are getting in to that raged edge of the dare we push any harder area.

www.predatormastersforums.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1455558

Remember that what we have acess to on the net is often no better than the claims of the guys years ago with what they thought were "real" velocities that when modern science actually worked them out proved that to reach those numbers pressures far exceeded the strength of the materials in use during that period of history.

To paraphrase The Most Interesting Man In The World, "Stay Curious My Friend" and you notice the little tag that says" Drink Responsibly" ? My version is "Reload Responsibly"

Just some food for thought.

Greg

[Deleted]

Many thanks for sharing. Some of this data is consistent with what I have. 75gr, 85gr and 95gr loads are specially interesting to me and the 6x45 has a lot to offer, even form a 20" barrel.

[GLSHOOTER]

Sept 28, 2011 21:00:40 GMT -8 @sergiomartinez said:

Many thanks for sharing. Some of this data is consistent with what I have. 75gr, 85gr and 95gr loads are specially interesting to me and the 6x45 has a lot to offer, even form a 20" barrel.

I feel that when you step across the line and must single load the rounds you might as well get a long boxed bolt gun and call it good. Those long box AR Mags are not common and to make one up is beyond the time and abilities of many shooters.

I also feel that if you want to shoot the big bullets and want to spend the $$'s it is your business but as for me I prefer to have a bit more flexibility in my armament.

Greg

[Deleted]

No single feed ever.

The facts are:
-to gain some decent OAL is very simple. 2.25 (H&K, canmega, some Cmags for baseline)
-to get to the max I have that is 2.45 is a little more involved but not crazy complex and it works great and it gives me 10 shots out of a 20 rounds magazine.

So, for practical use I have the standard COAL and magazines and for the long range where one wants to maximize the potential of the best and longest bullets, one rarely needs more than 10 shots. I never load more than 5 to 7 but I could prepare for more.

Bottom line: one has options. Having options is good.

[Deleted]

Sept 29, 2011 19:45:06 GMT -8 @sergiomartinez said:

No single feed ever.

The facts are:
-to gain some decent OAL is very simple. 2.25 (H&K, canmega, some Cmags for baseline)
-to get to the max I have that is 2.45 is a little more involved but not crazy complex and it works great and it gives me 10 shots out of a 20 rounds magazine.

So, for practical use I have the standard COAL and magazines and for the long range where one wants to maximize the potential of the best and longest bullets, one rarely needs more than 10 shots. I never load more than 5 to 7 but I could prepare for more.

Bottom line: one has options. Having options is good.

So let me get this straight. You use the expensive mags, you put a lot of time into building these mags you exceed pressure limits and you only gain 100 fps at best?

Thats why I shoot a 243 LBC. Cmags cost less than $20.00 a piece, The bolt is $5.00 extra. So for less than you will spend for an H&K mag I can get 2750 to 2800 FPS with a 105 Amax. And all this is doable while staying under the safe pressure limits.

[Deleted]

I gain 100fps compared to what? what caliber, what load, what barrel length, twist, what exactly?

some folks get it all wrong almost all the time.

I have lots of mags. Expensive and cheap ones like Cmags that I can convert too.
Some convert in 5 minutes for very decent gain in OAL.
I shoot nato cases that are certified for 62K+ PSI.

I also shoot Grendel and 6.5x47 lapua and I like them all the difference is the thousands of once fired NATO rounds that I have in the basement I can reuse and it is a nice and fun little round to reload and shoot.

Anyone interested in having some constructive discussions about the 6x45 in this post?

Thanks.

[Deleted]

Nope because posting OVER pressure loads on a open forum is bad for BHW and all its readers, when someone goes and blows there self up ,and then goes and tells everyone they got there load deta hear...... Is bad business anyway you look at it.

[Deleted]

Who posted any overpressure loads? where?