|
|
Post by gpsman007 on Jul 7, 2015 15:37:03 GMT -8
savage model 10 308 or 6.5 creedmoor or 260 Rem
which and why Thanks for playing
Edit: ok before anyone asks 1K yard gun punching paper killing deer and if it keeps getting worse I might need to put down some terrorists and such
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2015 16:09:21 GMT -8
savage model 10 308 or 6.5 creedmoor or 260 Rem
which and why Thanks for playing
Edit: ok before anyone asks 1K yard gun punching paper killing deer and if it keeps getting worse I might need to put down some terrorists and such
My choice out of the three you listed is the 260. The 308 struggles to make 1000 and stay supersonic, but would be my second choice out of the three. The Creedmoor doesn't offer anything the 260 can't do. The Creedmoor runs at higher pressure and has single source brass. The 260 has it all when it comes to quality brass, as well as longer brass life because of lower pressures. If Lapua would make Creedmoor brass it would be a plus for the cartridge but I don't see that happening with the 6.5x47 and the 260 already on their list. |
|
|
|
you pick
Jul 10, 2015 21:38:57 GMT -8
via mobile
Post by Master Yoda on Jul 10, 2015 21:38:57 GMT -8
260 Remington
|
|
lerms
Senior Member
Posts: 113
|
Post by lerms on Jul 11, 2015 2:56:55 GMT -8
I asked a similar question before and after all the asking and reading my choice was the 260 Remington. With what type of factory ammo was available from hunting to long range and then reloading capability it seem the like the best choice.
Lerms
|
|
|
|
Post by devildogandboy on Jul 11, 2015 12:08:29 GMT -8
i have an 308 and 6.5 creedmoor and have never shot a 260 before but did research the caliber when lookinng at the 6.5 creedmoor. the 260 did offer components readily while the 6.5cm did not at that time(brass). i got the 6.5cm because i was intrigued by all the positive comments i read and now with brass and components being easier to get and brass offered by 3 companies with winchester manufacturing ammo i am glad of my choice. it shoots lights out and easy to load for.
Bruce
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2015 12:50:38 GMT -8
i have an 308 and 6.5 creedmoor and have never shot a 260 before but did research the caliber when lookinng at the 6.5 creedmoor. the 260 did offer components readily while the 6.5cm did not at that time(brass). i got the 6.5cm because i was intrigued by all the positive comments i read and now with brass and components being easier to get and brass offered by 3 companies with winchester manufacturing ammo i am glad of my choice. it shoots lights out and easy to load for. Bruce The reason I gave my comments the way I did is I happen to own both, the 260 and the Creedmoor. The Creedmoor has yet to empress me enough to think it is the be all to end all. All it is, is a spin off of the 260 to sell more rifles. So far it looks like it has done it's intended job. Is it better than the 260? NO, lowering capacity and raising working pressure will always lead to premature case failure as well as eroded throats. When you increase pressure because of diminished case capacity and try to regain velocity lost your only alternative is to use faster powder or compress the same powder charge from the larger case. Which leads us to the next point. Changing the shoulder angle to 30* does NOT make an improved case. At the end of the day the Creedmoor is nothing more than a short 260 with the shoulder angle changed. In fact you can make Creedmoor brass by running 243, 260, 7-08 or 308 through your Creedmoor size die and CUTTING to length. You will have to turn the necks if you form it from other cases or you can just shoot a 260 and buy match quality brass from Lapua. Hornady and Winchester are not known for selling high quality brass. More like if that's all there is you have to use it. |
|
|
|
Post by devildogandboy on Jul 11, 2015 18:07:26 GMT -8
i have an 308 and 6.5 creedmoor and have never shot a 260 before but did research the caliber when lookinng at the 6.5 creedmoor. the 260 did offer components readily while the 6.5cm did not at that time(brass). i got the 6.5cm because i was intrigued by all the positive comments i read and now with brass and components being easier to get and brass offered by 3 companies with winchester manufacturing ammo i am glad of my choice. it shoots lights out and easy to load for. Bruce The reason I gave my comments the way I did is I happen to own both, the 260 and the Creedmoor. The Creedmoor has yet to empress me enough to think it is the be all to end all. All it is, is a spin off of the 260 to sell more rifles. So far it looks like it has done it's intended job. Is it better than the 260? NO, lowering capacity and raising working pressure will always lead to premature case failure as well as eroded throats. When you increase pressure because of diminished case capacity and try to regain velocity lost your only alternative is to use faster powder or compress the same powder charge from the larger case. Which leads us to the next point. Changing the shoulder angle to 30* does NOT make an improved case. At the end of the day the Creedmoor is nothing more than a short 260 with the shoulder angle changed. In fact you can make Creedmoor brass by running 243, 260, 7-08 or 308 through your Creedmoor size die and CUTTING to length. You will have to turn the necks if you form it from other cases or you can just shoot a 260 and buy match quality brass from Lapua. Hornady and Winchester are not known for selling high quality brass. More like if that's all there is you have to use it. i understand your point of view about the pressure, cases and such, but that wasn't a consideration for me at the time. the comments i read did make it sound like it was the best thing out there and i wanted to find out for myself. it does have it;s short comings but it does shoot excellent. i have no regrets buying it! one day i may get an 260 to play around with, i don't shoot competition, it's just for me shooting targets for the sheer enjoyment of the sport! Bruce |
|
|
|
Post by GLSHOOTER on Jul 11, 2015 20:03:27 GMT -8
I don't think there's any question that the Creedmoor can punch holes very well. I know that Ritch and I approach cartridge selection based on his criteria of case life and lowest pressures to get it done. His background is itty-bitty groups and brass quality is a big contributor in that area. Mine were not so itty-bitty in the old days but now it is paramount in importance. The PD population hates me because of it. I'll hammer brass in some settings if I need to but by and large I like longer brass life hence I go for a less high pressure round.
I like 300 Win. Mags for out yonder but I have a 260 ready to go but oddly enough I am going smaller and smaller with a 243 LBC the past few months. It'll hold its own.
Greg
|
|
|
|
Post by blackblue on Jul 11, 2015 20:09:40 GMT -8
260 lapua brass isn't working in many chambers either, neck thickness maybe? Creedmoor fits better in mag boxes wher the 260 runs out of room with the heavier bullets and in theory with the sharper shoulder angle of the creedmoor should help limit throat erosion over the 260. Either 6.5 flavor is better than the 308.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2015 5:47:03 GMT -8
260 lapua brass isn't working in many chambers either, neck thickness maybe? Creedmoor fits better in mag boxes wher the 260 runs out of room with the heavier bullets and in theory with the sharper shoulder angle of the creedmoor should help limit throat erosion over the 260. Either 6.5 flavor is better than the 308. I will agree with you on one point. That is both the Creedmoor and the 260 are better than a 308. The rest of your rebuttal sounds straight from the internet. The 260 is a SAAMI case that has tolerances that it has to be met when being produced. NO , and I repeat NO manufacturer is going intentionally ship any brass that is not within those specifications. Another words, if it doesn't fit it's a non spec chamber, or the brass has been altered. This statement goes for all brass regardless of who the manufacturer is. What it comes down to is some manufacturer's have tighter tolerances in both weight and in dimensions. Your statement about the 30* shoulder should help with throat erosion is laughable. If we are talking about paper punching cartridges, one of the worst in this class is the 6.5X284. If you look up the SAAMI drawing you will find it has a 35* shoulder. All of the short mags have a 30* shoulder. So you are saying their barrels will outlast a 260 barrel, with a 20* shoulder? I don't think so. The last part of your post, about OAL and fitting in a mag box. If this is a big deal ( and it is to some ) you will need a custom throated reamer made. If you chose to go with the standard off the shelf chambering the 260 will still out run the Creedmoor every day even with the bullet sitting deeper in the case. There is not substitute for case capacity and the 260 has it. The only complaint I hear is about the major manufactures are trying to protect all of us from ourselves. They move the lead out to maximum spec to reduce pressure. They also don't typically do any factory loads using compressed powder. Any one who has been to a paper shooting match will tell you, Almost all target shooters use compressed loads to keep their densities at or over 100%. So where is the problem seating bullets a little deep? How much case capacity did you really loose? By the way you can hunt with a compressed load too. |
|
|
|
Post by blackblue on Jul 19, 2015 15:23:37 GMT -8
I wasn't rebutting just stating what I had run across in my research of 6.5's for my self and any 6.5 is better than none, had a creedmoor, BHW 264lbc and currently have a 6.5x47. My statements were towards custom chambers( one of the points of building a cutom rifle right?) lapua 260 brass has a slightly thicker neck if I remember correctly that was causing problems for some people in tighter chambers and neck turning was reqired. Is it not documented that shaper shoulder angles help with throats being torched? My reference was to chasing the lands that some people do and run out of room in the mag box.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2015 17:23:56 GMT -8
I wasn't rebutting just stating what I had run across in my research of 6.5's for my self and any 6.5 is better than none, had a creedmoor, BHW 264lbc and currently have a 6.5x47. My statements were towards custom chambers( one of the points of building a cutom rifle right?) lapua 260 brass has a slightly thicker neck if I remember correctly that was causing problems for some people in tighter chambers and neck turning was reqired. Is it not documented that shaper shoulder angles help with throats being torched? My reference was to chasing the lands that some people do and run out of room in the mag box. If someone has a custom chamber and the brass doesn't fit, how can that be the brass manufacturer's problem? Who ever designed or made the reamer should have noted on the shank of the reamer what the neck diameter is. Do you think brass for a .262 neck PPC automatically fits the chamber? No it won't but that's not the manufacturers problem. If you don't like turning necks buy a reamer with a larger diameter neck. |
|
|
|
Post by blackblue on Jul 19, 2015 17:46:41 GMT -8
Lapua brass being a fairly recent release and people already having rifles in 260, just stating issues that have came up for other and could be useful to the OP.
|
|
|
|
Post by GLSHOOTER on Jul 19, 2015 18:51:23 GMT -8
I just happen to have some new 260 Lapua. Neck thickness is 0.0165. With a bullet seated it comes out exactly 0.297. This is considered normal case neck diameter according to my book.
If guys are having issues the chamber has been cut for neck turned brass. SAAMI spec minimum neck is 0.298 with +0.002 allowed so 298-300 is normal. SAAMI spec loaded round MAX is. 0.297.
Greg
|
|
