Problems with 75-105 gr bullets

[lange22250]

I got a BHW 20" 1 in 8 6x45 barrel, primarily for shooting 2-4 moa steel in 3 gun matches matches out to a max of 900. All the bullet needs to do is hit the target, not worried about terminal ballistics. I really want to be able to use heavier (87-105gr) bullets for the BC but with the Horandy 87 and 105 HPBT's I can't get them to stablize and give me anything under 6 MOA even doing load development with .3 gr increments in using the data I've been able to find.

I can get under 1 MOA with a 55gn Hornady BT load that I just tossed together to test the functioning of the rifle. Based on that I think it's the way I'm loading the heavier bullets, not the way the gun was built.


I have tired 2.26 COL with the 87's and 2.26 and 2.34 with the 105's. When I tested for the the free bore length it looks like both are off the lands but I've not invested in a real measuring tool yet.

Looking through some of the other threads it seems that others have had decent success.

Any suggestions for either changes in loads or bullets to try?


Thanks. 

[Deleted]

Lets start at the beginning. What are the loads you are trying to shoot.
Powder, the amount of powder, Bullet, Primmer, brass etc.

[lange22250]

Oct 5, 2015 14:22:32 GMT -8 @rjohnson said:

Lets start at the beginning. What are the loads you are trying to shoot.
Powder, the amount of powder, Bullet, Primmer, brass etc.

I'm using Lake City, all 09 without a primer crimp. RCBC dies. BLC-2 powder with CCI standard SR primers.

The 105 Hornady HPBT's, COL of 2.26, I used test loads from 24.5 to 26.5 in half grain increments with pressure signs at 26.5 

The 87 gn Hornady HPBT's I used a col of 2.26 and 2.34 with a powder range from 26.3 to 27.5 in .3 grain increments, no pressure signs.

The 75gn Hornady AMAX with a COL of 2.26. Powder range of 28.1 to 29 in .3 grain increments.

The 55 Hornady BT's I used 28.2 grains at a COL of 2.26 and the shoot at just under an inch.

All loaded on a Lyman turret press.

[Deleted]

Oct 5, 2015 15:04:10 GMT -8 lange22250 said:

Oct 5, 2015 14:22:32 GMT -8 @rjohnson said:

Lets start at the beginning. What are the loads you are trying to shoot.
Powder, the amount of powder, Bullet, Primmer, brass etc.

I'm using Lake City, all 09 without a primer crimp. RCBC dies. BLC-2 powder with CCI standard SR primers.

The 105 Hornady HPBT's, COL of 2.26, I used test loads from 24.5 to 26.5 in half grain increments with pressure signs at 26.5 

The 87 gn Hornady HPBT's I used a col of 2.26 and 2.34 with a powder range from 26.3 to 27.5 in .3 grain increments, no pressure signs.

The 75gn Hornady AMAX with a COL of 2.26. Powder range of 28.1 to 29 in .3 grain increments.

The 55 Hornady BT's I used 28.2 grains at a COL of 2.26 and the shoot at just under an inch.

All loaded on a Lyman turret press.

There are a few things I would try before I threw in the towel.
First would be to get an accurate measurement where the bullet contacts the lands. The second thing would be to shoot a powder not effected by ambient temperature. BLC-2 is one of the worst powders that shows pressure signs. I would try some RL15 with the 87 grain bullets. 2015 is another powder that has been known to produce with the 87's and the 75 grain bullets.
The 105 grain bullets are an exercise in futility with the small case. There is NOT enough room in the case for the powder and the bullet. If you are shooting them from a magazine, the bullet is seated so deep , it's past the drive shank at the case mouth.
Stick with the 87 grain bullets. They are the best balance of weight and B.C. and will work at magazine length Try some different powders and you will find an accurate combination.

[lange22250]

Oct 5, 2015 15:55:39 GMT -8 @rjohnson said:

Oct 5, 2015 15:04:10 GMT -8 lange22250 said:

I'm using Lake City, all 09 without a primer crimp. RCBC dies. BLC-2 powder with CCI standard SR primers.

The 105 Hornady HPBT's, COL of 2.26, I used test loads from 24.5 to 26.5 in half grain increments with pressure signs at 26.5 

The 87 gn Hornady HPBT's I used a col of 2.26 and 2.34 with a powder range from 26.3 to 27.5 in .3 grain increments, no pressure signs.

The 75gn Hornady AMAX with a COL of 2.26. Powder range of 28.1 to 29 in .3 grain increments.

The 55 Hornady BT's I used 28.2 grains at a COL of 2.26 and the shoot at just under an inch.

All loaded on a Lyman turret press.

There are a few things I would try before I threw in the towel.
First would be to get an accurate measurement where the bullet contacts the lands. The second thing would be to shoot a powder not effected by ambient temperature. BLC-2 is one of the worst powders that shows pressure signs. I would try some RL15 with the 87 grain bullets. 2015 is another powder that has been known to produce with the 87's and the 75 grain bullets.
The 105 grain bullets are an exercise in futility with the small case. There is NOT enough room in the case for the powder and the bullet. If you are shooting them from a magazine, the bullet is seated so deep , it's past the drive shank at the case mouth.
Stick with the 87 grain bullets. They are the best balance of weight and B.C. and will work at magazine length Try some different powders and you will find an accurate combination.

Thanks, I'm getting frustrated with this gun but I really want it to work out.

[Deleted]

Don't get frustrated. Remember, you have to feed it what it likes. Stick with the extruded powder like 8208, 4895, 2015, Benchmark, etc.
Seat your bullets as close to the rifling as possible. Move up slowly, don't go more than 2 tenths of a grain at a time.
Take notes and watch for early pressure signs.

[GLSHOOTER]

I've shot the 6X45 for over three decades in IPSC and 3Gun. I have shot the Hornady 87 BTHP almost exclusively. When I moved to 500 yard F-class with one I used the same bullet. The powders mentioned will produce well. Ritch will get you lined out.

Greg

[luv2shoot]

Oct 5, 2015 13:20:00 GMT -8 lange22250 said:

I got a BHW 20" 1 in 8 6x45 barrel, primarily for shooting 2-4 moa steel in 3 gun matches matches out to a max of 900. All the bullet needs to do is hit the target, not worried about terminal ballistics. I really want to be able to use heavier (87-105gr) bullets for the BC but with the Horandy 87 and 105 HPBT's I can't get them to stablize and give me anything under 6 MOA even doing load development with .3 gr increments in using the data I've been able to find.

I can get under 1 MOA with a 55gn Hornady BT load that I just tossed together to test the functioning of the rifle. Based on that I think it's the way I'm loading the heavier bullets, not the way the gun was built.


I have tired 2.26 COL with the 87's and 2.26 and 2.34 with the 105's. When I tested for the the free bore length it looks like both are off the lands but I've not invested in a real measuring tool yet.

Looking through some of the other threads it seems that others have had decent success.

Any suggestions for either changes in loads or bullets to try?


Thanks. 

Did you ever get anywhere with this issue? I had the same problem. I'm selling my 1/8 bbls. They only liked 75grn and lower. 80 and higher patterned. Gonna try a 1/10

[GLSHOOTER]

The poster has not been on since the day he posted that back in October. I always hate it when a problem comes up and nine times out of ten when it is worked out the results are never communicated to the board.

Greg

[luv2shoot]

Agreed. Not very helpful. In the interest of our community and the "2nd",  it's best we support and stick together in all ways.
My2cts.

[GLSHOOTER]

Jan 21, 2016 10:00:19 GMT -8 luv2shoot said:

Agreed. Not very helpful. In the interest of our community and the "2nd",  it's best we support and stick together in all ways.
My2cts.

This board is just the tip of the iceberg. BHW sponsors three other Forums and problems plus kudos are done every day. It could be as simple as running down some parts or dealing with trying to teach long distance to new loaders. We keep busy as Pro Staff and the BHW resident staff as they go through their days.

Greg

[sharkhunter]

For what it is worth.  I have a 1 in 8" twist BH barrel and I  couldn't get 85gr game kings to group with h335.  It was shooting 4-5" groups at 100yrds.  So I switched to IMR3031(had it on hand) and the gun loved them 1" 5 shot group.  That is all I able to produce with the 7 power that is on it.  Maybe one of you guy could tighten that up for me if it was in your hands:<).  

[GLSHOOTER]

Jan 22, 2016 11:49:43 GMT -8 sharkhunter said:

For what it is worth.  I have a 1 in 8" twist BH barrel and I  couldn't get 85gr game kings to group with h335.  It was shooting 4-5" groups at 100yrds.  So I switched to IMR3031(had it on hand) and the gun loved them 1" 5 shot group.  That is all I able to produce with the 7 power that is on it.  Maybe one of you guy could tighten that up for me if it was in your hands:<).  

And that's why we are handloaders and not case fillers.

Greg